Michigan’s legislative maps are facing a legal challenge.
The state’s Independent Citizens Redistricting Commission created its maps in 2021, bringing the process to residents instead of lawmakers for the first time in state history.
Buta federal court recently found districts in Metro Detroit violated the Voting Rights Act and ordered the maps redrawn. The decision comes during a major election year.
For more than three years, Lansing resident MC Rothhorn served on the commission. He stepped down in December amid the lawsuit.
WKAR's Sophia Saliby spoke with him to reflect on his time serving on the commission and these latest developments.
Interview Highlights
On his experience serving on the commission
It was fantastic. I mean, there's 13 of us, right? So, we were able to bond over Zoom and in short moments. I think we had staff that really made it possible for us to bond. I think they nurtured our development of trust. I think they nurtured our ability to actually understand what we were getting into as laypeople who don't have experience.
On the legal challenges to the maps drawn by the commission
We drew it with people in mind. And I think the people of Detroit did tell us right that, "Hey, we didn't do it right." So, that doesn't mean that we did it wrong. But what I'm suggesting is like, I know that there were, yeah, there were things that we could have done better. But we did our darndest. We did our best.
And I think that whatever does happen with the outcome, because I think it's being appealed, whatever the commission is. It's a public process, but it's also a legal process. It's enshrined in our Constitution.
On the advice he has for the new members of the commission
I think they're going to do great. Honestly, I think understanding that you can listen. Like we all have these powers of reasoning and critical thinking, and we can all do it. And I think citizen-led government is huge. It's a great opportunity. And I think it's important that we try it, and it's a risk to try it. So, I thank these people for accepting it.
Interview Transcript
Sophia Saliby: Michigan’s legislative maps are facing a legal challenge.
The state’s Independent Citizens Redistricting Commission created its maps in 2021, bringing the process to residents instead of lawmakers for the first time in state history.
But a federal court recently found districts in Metro Detroit violated the Voting Rights Act and ordered the maps redrawn. That decision also comes during a major election year.
For more than three years, Lansing resident MC Rothhorn served on the Citizens Redistricting Commission, and he recently just stepped down in December.
MC joins me now to reflect on his time serving on the group and these latest developments. Thank you for being here.
MC Rothhorn: You're welcome.
Saliby: Can you talk us through that decision to step down?
Rothhorn: Well, I had two other colleagues who were also stepping down. And it's 2024 as we speak and over the last, I'll say six months, in 2023, the rest of my life, so to speak, has caught up. I work with cooperatives, and there's, I'll just say a lot of cooperation happening at the moment. And so it feels good. There's energy in my neighborhood around cooperation and in my cooperative ventures.
It just felt like this piece, I could hand it over to other members of our public, whether they're citizens or not, frankly, but those who have signed up and who have volunteered to be on this commission. And it feels like you know, they will also help create a great process. I think that this commission doesn't end with the people from 2020.
Saliby: We first talked in September of 2020, and I'll take you back a little bit. You spoke about being excited, a little overwhelmed by this job ahead of you, and that you wanted to be a part of this fair and transparent process. How did this experience over the past few years measure up to those expectations back in 2020?
Rothhorn: It measured up. It was fantastic. I mean, there's 13 of us, right? So, we were able to bond over Zoom and in short moments. I think we had staff that really made it possible for us to bond. I think they nurtured our development of trust. I think they nurtured our ability to actually understand what we were getting into as laypeople who don't have experience.
And I think we got to meet the public, too. And so, I think that was all, and sometimes the public treated us like celebrities, you know? There's a lot of people in Michigan who I think helped make the commission happen, and I think there was a large and overwhelming number of people who just care. And so, it was great. It met my expectations, absolutely.
Saliby: What was the most challenging part about being part of the commission?
Rothhorn: That we weren't all 13 able to get together. That was the most challenging part, right? There were two who weren't able to come in person. And I think they didn't benefit from you know, the small interactions in the in-person contact, right? It's a human process, right?
Yhere's so many things that are hard to describe or define, and I think that part was, probably the biggest challenge because we all 13 of us didn't get to gel. And that was part of what I really enjoyed.
Saliby: The maps you and your fellow commissioners drew for state House and Senate districts have been thrown out by judges who found race was illegally used to influence map boundaries in Detroit, which is a majority black city and its whiter suburbs.
Do you defend the way these maps were drawn? Or do you agree that they need to be redone?
Rothhorn: It's happening, right? And I don't want to suggest that I know a better way to do it. I don't know that my opinion matters, honestly. This is where like all 13 of us did our darndest to do it, and we did it with professional guidance and help, right?
So, I don't think we did it "wrong." And I know there was no malice and that doesn't mean the law is interpreted and we have a very human system, right?
We drew it with people in mind. And I think the people of Detroit did tell us right that, "Hey, we didn't do it right." So, that doesn't mean that we did it wrong. But what I'm suggesting is like, I know that there were, yeah, there were things that we could have done better. But we did our darndest. We did our best.
And I think that whatever does happen with the outcome, because I think it's being appealed, whatever the commission is. It's a public process, but it's also a legal process. It's enshrined in our Constitution.
It's good, like the way that the process is had led us to this outcome and to this legal challenge and the outcome of this legal challenge, whatever happens I think it will be positive because I think it's part of it's all part of our democratic system though, the court challenge is also a piece of it.
Saliby: There have been suggestions that a special master should be the one to draw these maps, an independent party. Do you think that might be a better option than having the commission go back to the board and redraw the districts?
Rothhorn: I'll be honest, like, I do think the Constitution is set up with language that the people asked for, right? There was a number of people who asked for this right in the state of Michigan, and I think we should comply with that. Like, what is in the Constitution I think is good.
Saliby: You've stepped down and the two other members have stepped down, so there's three new people on this commission. Do you have any advice for them?
Rothhorn: I think they're going to do great. Honestly, I think understanding that you can listen. Like we all have these powers of reasoning and critical thinking, and we can all do it. And I think citizen-led government is huge. It's a great opportunity. And I think it's important that we try it, and it's a risk to try it. So, I thank these people for accepting it.
And trust that if there's conflicts and there's problems, like work it out. Listening, I think is a huge piece. Building trust, right? And that takes being vulnerable, and I think it means risking a little bit of your own opinions and trying to not act only on your opinions and listening to try to say "Where do my opinions fit? Where are we not, right? Where's consensus?"
I think all those things matter. So, I think my advice is listen and build trust, and trust that this is a great process.
Saliby: MC Rothhorn is a Lansing resident and a former member of the Michigan Independent Citizens Redistricting Commission. Thank you for joining me.
Rothhorn: You're welcome. Thank you for asking.
This conversation has been edited for clarity and conciseness.
