A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
In the new movie "Paper Tiger," a middle-class father of two in Queens, New York, takes a job that he thinks might set him on the road to financial success. His older, wealthier brother set it up for him.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "PAPER TIGER")
ADAM DRIVER: (As Gary Pearl) This is the Gowanus Canal. This could be the perfect opportunity for us to do something substantial together.
MARTÍNEZ: The thing is, he left out a pretty important detail. The job involves working for the Russian Mafia. That omission tears the family apart.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "PAPER TIGER")
MILES TELLER: (As Irwin Pearl) We had a problem down at the canal, and it's led to some things. I walked in on something they didn't want me to see.
(SOUNDBITE OF MUSIC)
MARTÍNEZ: The domineering big brother, Gary Pearl, is played by Adam Driver. And the more sheepish younger brother, Irwin, is Miles Teller.
TELLER: Gary, he's got a lot of charisma. He's a very impressive guy, former NYPD cop, always did very well for himself. And there's a bit of an estrangement in the beginning of the film. And Gary kind of rolls into town and has a business idea that he wants to run by me. And it's very exciting, the opportunity to go into business with Gary and, as we say in the movie, show the world what the Pearl brothers can do. You know, it's our time.
MARTÍNEZ: I spoke recently with both Teller and the movie's writer and director, James Gray.
When I'm watching Irwin, whenever Gary is next to him, it always does seem like there is this sense like he wasn't enough. Like, he didn't accomplish enough. Like, he didn't measure up to his brother. I see, alone, Irwin, you know, is the father of two boys, seemingly decently successful, maybe not as much as he wants to be. But at least there's something there that makes it seem like, OK, he's happy with what he has, until, I think, I see him standing next to his brother.
JAMES GRAY: Well, absolutely. I mean, isn't that life? It's never enough for you. I mean, the weird thing is I always saw that as a basic truth. Like, you can have two beautiful children and be married to this wonderful person. It doesn't matter. Somebody down the block is going to have a fancier car, and that's still going to be kind of an allure.
That attitude does lead to a kind of spiritual hole. I'm sorry to sound like I'm on the soapbox here. But if your only idea is to get more cars or you try to get a boat or something, that's not really paying attention to the things that actually do matter. The longer I live, the more I think the only thing that matters is my connection to other people and a sense of love, actually, as corny as that may sound. So, yes, it's in the DNA of the film. It's in the DNA of the script. That was the whole idea, really, of the story itself, that ambition, monetary ambition, can be a harmful thing in somebody's life.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "PAPER TIGER")
DRIVER: (As Gary Pearl) I looked after you your whole [expletive] life. Everything you love, I gave you. I shouldered that burden. I never asked you to look after me once, never.
TELLER: (As Irwin Pearl) Yeah, well, you [expletive] needed it.
DRIVER: (As Gary Pearl) That's the way you like to think about yourself. You need to think of yourself like that. Always putting on a big show, nothing real behind it.
GRAY: The other thing that's certainly true between brothers is there is the conscious side of you, right? My brother and I get along well or we don't. But there's always the unconscious thing, which is, which one of us do Mom and Dad love more?
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
GRAY: And that always provides a sort of tension.
TELLER: And I feel like usually it's the one that perhaps is loved more, never really thinks about that.
GRAY: Maybe you're right. I hadn't thought about that.
TELLER: (Laughter).
GRAY: You're probably right. Maybe that - maybe I'm the one that was loved less. Maybe that's my problem.
TELLER: (Laughter).
MARTÍNEZ: Or the brother that gets loved more maybe is embarrassed by it, sometimes.
GRAY: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: Sometimes they just don't want all the attention, and they want the younger brother - or the other brother to get some love.
GRAY: Oh, see, you just slipped. You said the younger brother. I think you're right. I think firstborn, you always have a kind of special place, right? I remember my mother once telling me, she said - I said, Mom, which one of us do you love more? I literally asked her that. And she said, well, you never feel the same way about your second child as you do your first. But I love you both differently. And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, what? And I was probably like 11 or 12.
TELLER: Your mom sounds like the mom from "Family Guy."
GRAY: Well, my mom was...
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
GRAY: My mom was more, you know, an urban terrorist at that point.
TELLER: (Laughter).
MARTÍNEZ: But, you know, James, that is exactly right, because - so I have a younger brother. And I was my mom's first. So whenever she talks about how much she loves us both, she says, I love you both equally. But then she says, in Spanish - (speaking Spanish) - you were always my first. So it's like, I don't know if that break - is that breaking the tie, technically? Is that what she's trying to tell me? Or...
GRAY: Yes.
MARTÍNEZ: ...I love you both, but - oh, she is? OK.
TELLER: I always get smothered with, my baby boy.
GRAY: (Laughter).
TELLER: And I'm the only...
MARTÍNEZ: You have two sisters, right?
TELLER: And I'm the only boy. I'm like, Mom, I am...
MARTÍNEZ: Yeah.
TELLER: ...Almost 40 years old.
(LAUGHTER)
GRAY: That's such an expression of love, though. But I think you're right. I think it's Mom saying the tiebreak is the first baby, which I have to say is - it's not great that parents might say that to their children. And we make those mistakes all the time. I live in fear that I've done that to my three children.
MARTÍNEZ: So, Miles, something happened to you this year that I'm fascinated by. So you were an investor in the Finnish Long Drink, a cocktail company. And it sold for about $325 million. A lot of money, a lot of money.
TELLER: Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: And you made it clear that you're not retiring from acting, right?
TELLER: (Laughter) Yeah.
MARTÍNEZ: But I was wondering, has this really changed how you see your acting career?
TELLER: No, not at all. It's all - if anything, I've just really appreciated longevity. To me, that's the thing, man. If you can hang around, and if you can work on your dream projects, great. But it's the time in between those that I continue to be kind of appreciative of. So, no, the Finnish Long Drink has not deterred me.
MARTÍNEZ: Yeah, because I was wondering if it maybe offered you more freedom to be choosy, I guess is what I'm wondering.
TELLER: No. You'll know when I'm really rich when I have, like, 10 dogs.
(LAUGHTER)
TELLER: And you just really don't see or hear from me for a long time.
GRAY: Miles, you better not retire. That would be terrible. He's a - Miles Teller is a great actor.
TELLER: I'm not.
GRAY: You're a great actor.
TELLER: No, he's starting that rumor. I'm very much for hire.
GRAY: Good.
MARTÍNEZ: Perfect.
GRAY: Because you're fabulous.
TELLER: (Laughter).
MARTÍNEZ: That's director James Gray and actor Miles Teller. Their new film is called "Paper Tiger." James, Miles, thank you very much.
TELLER: Thank you
GRAY: Thank you.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "LIGHT UP")
ROBYN: (Singing) I just want to be the one that you choose when your mind drifts off, thinking about... Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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